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View Full Version : Fuck You All, I'm On Crack


duckula
25-07-2004, 10:38 PM
The title is untrue (the bit about crack) but on a serious note, what are peoples feelings on narcotics? Free choice and legalisation or should the government protect it's citizens from themselves?

apoggy
25-07-2004, 10:42 PM
I'd like to see an experiment to legalise drugs (not all maybe the softer ones) to see if usage levels go up or down. Its my opinion that some (maybe most) people start due to rebelious tendancies, if it wasnt seen as a rebelious act would they start in the first place?

Spire
25-07-2004, 10:46 PM
Well, I do know tobacco kills millions more than marijuana does.

I don't use any illegal drugs, and I don't have any desire to.

Dyce_Blue
25-07-2004, 10:51 PM
I read this article once about the lack of alcoholism in Vietnam because there is no age limit. Little kids drink and demonstrate less alcoholism and rebelious tendencies because drinking is a normal everyday thing. If they were to legalize drugs here in America, I think there would be a 10 year period where everyone binges and it ruins 1/3 of the population. It would eventually calm down though. I still don't think it is a good idea, because I wouldn't want my president or teacher or...parent hopped up on all kinds of goofballs. By the way, I think our Dutch boy Guido could better answer this question, being from the Netherlands and all.

CFC
25-07-2004, 10:51 PM
No. I don't really see any need for them to be legal.

Narg
26-07-2004, 12:14 AM
If they became legal there would be more people using them, and a higher risk for non-users, i.e someone gets high on lega crack, and goes for a drive, kills 2 ppl... Drugs are bad mmmkay.

Dyce_Blue
26-07-2004, 12:17 AM
That is a good point. Drunk drivers already kill and injure enough people, drugs further distort the mind. It would be way too dangerous.

Hazzle
26-07-2004, 01:08 AM
K...illegal substances kill less people every year than the legal ones...so shall we ban the legal ones too?

So...that doesn't work.

Legalise them all. Drug crime would drop...Drug barons would be killed off...look what Prohibition did for people like Capone...and look at how the gangsters' power dwindled as stuff got legalised more and more...

Legalise the lot of it. This is from a lawyer, so you'd think I'd be against it...but nope...studied it in a lot of depth...trust me...legalising them all would be the way to go.

Oh, and what Poggs says is true...the rebellion thing plays its part.

apoggy
26-07-2004, 02:09 AM
You could look at the rebellion issue further though and ask, if illegal drugs were made legal taking them wouldnt be rebelling. So would the youth of tomorrow find even weirder and probably more dangerous things to do to themselves to rebel?

MC117
26-07-2004, 05:50 PM
me = drug free! (yay for me)

hasselbrad
26-07-2004, 06:13 PM
I am for decriminalization. Prohibition didn't work with alcohol, and it's not working with drugs. The illegality just drives people to further depths before they get help.

jadie
26-07-2004, 06:13 PM
Interesting topic, actually when drugs were made illegal in America, the crime rate went WAY more up (i swear thats not proper grammar), and there was more smuggling, but when they were made legal, the crime rate went back down...

Elijahfan
26-07-2004, 06:42 PM
I am for decriminalization. Prohibition didn't work with alcohol, and it's not working with drugs. The illegality just drives people to further depths before they get help.

i agree, it's true in history and it's true now. i remember learning about it in history, it was around the 1920s or early 1900s that the government prohibited it and crime rose drastically. that's how all the gangsters and secret clubs (serving acohol) began.

Hazzle
26-07-2004, 10:57 PM
i agree, it's true in history and it's true now. i remember learning about it in history, it was around the 1920s or early 1900s that the government prohibited it and crime rose drastically. that's how all the gangsters and secret clubs (serving acohol) began.

Glad everyone agrees with this argument :)

ryan
26-07-2004, 11:01 PM
i think legalizing most drugs would be stupid.
think about how many people would then be tempted by their increased availability and totally ruin their lives.
it's not like you can be a casual heroin, cocaine, or crack user. once you do it a few times, your life is officially shit.

Hazzle
26-07-2004, 11:04 PM
i think legalizing most drugs would be stupid.
think about how many people would then be tempted by their increased availability and totally ruin their lives.
it's not like you can be a casual heroin, cocaine, or crack user. once you do it a few times, your life is officially shit.

Y'know studies have shown cigarettes are more addictive than Heroin? And what about caffeine addiction, which SOOO many people suffer from. Why is it these are less disastrous addictions? Oh yes...because they're legal so people don't have the added tensions of doing something illegal, and also don't have to lie, steal and be otherwise a fraud to keep their habit going. Also the quality is guaranteed to be "safe"...on so many fronts it's better. Also speaking as one who lives in a PUBLIC HEALTHCARE state...if we legalised it, and regulated it using TAXES, that extra money could be put into drug rehab and other things...as opposed to going into a drug baron's pockets.

Oh...and our prisons wouldn't be overcrowded with people who've been thrown in for mere possession.

ryan
26-07-2004, 11:19 PM
it's rather hard to die from an overdose of tobacco or caffiene.
it's very easy to die from an overdose of cocaine or heroin.

plus, how often do you see someone who just smoked a pack of cigarettes or drank some coffee start convulsing, throwing up, and unresponsive because they did a little too much?

it'll never happen. not in our lifetime, anyway. why argue about it?

Dyce_Blue
26-07-2004, 11:31 PM
Anyone who has seen Pulp Fiction knows what happens when too much cocaine is taken, especially by wispy blonde Umas. If we were to legalize drugs though, Colombia would be out of business permanently, and the entire population would go back to kidnapping tourists for ransom to earn money. This would translate into much less distribution and much more use.

There is a reason that drugs are illegal. They are dangerous and deteriorate your mind and body. I wouldn't want an individual with control of nuclear weapons, like the president, to have drugs readily available. It's just not a good idea to legalize drugs anywhere in the world. It limits progress and may create an epidemic of very unhealthy habits.

acliff
26-07-2004, 11:35 PM
Y'know studies have shown cigarettes are more addictive than Heroin? And what about caffeine addiction, which SOOO many people suffer from. Why is it these are less disastrous addictions? Oh yes...because they're legal so people don't have the added tensions of doing something illegal, and also don't have to lie, steal and be otherwise a fraud to keep their habit going. Also the quality is guaranteed to be "safe"...on so many fronts it's better. Also speaking as one who lives in a PUBLIC HEALTHCARE state...if we legalised it, and regulated it using TAXES, that extra money could be put into drug rehab and other things...as opposed to going into a drug baron's pockets.

Oh...and our prisons wouldn't be overcrowded with people who've been thrown in for mere possession.

More addictive than heroin, cigarettes may be, but I'd rather have a bus driver smoke a cigarette than take heroin. I'd rather see a lecturer drink a can of coke, than use a couple of tabs of acid.

Its not just the addiction thats the problem. Its the effects inebriating effects of the drugs during the effect time, and the aftereffects. You don't need to be addicted to crack to experience what it has to offer. God forbid you're driving home.

Pinkfairy
26-07-2004, 11:42 PM
it's rather hard to die from an overdose of tobacco or caffiene.
it's very easy to die from an overdose of cocaine or heroin.

plus, how often do you see someone who just smoked a pack of cigarettes or drank some coffee start convulsing, throwing up, and unresponsive because they did a little too much?

it'll never happen. not in our lifetime, anyway. why argue about it?
Clearly, you've never seen stupid kids experimenting. Ha, in seventh grade a group of us were doing an experiment on how the nitcotine of cigarettes affected your lungs (for real). A couple of hours later, I was on the toilet throwing up for about ten minutes.
You made a good point.Still, Hazzle's idea is not bad, but it's not wise considering how many stupid people live.
Say drugs are legal. Sure, nobody gets addicted unless they allow it. Most people know the consequences of doing drugs (most drugs are designed with the purpose of getting people addicted). But Most people are stupid, and people will try them. Legalizing drugs would mean approving the bad habbit and providing people with justification for misconduct.

Hazzle
26-07-2004, 11:47 PM
Prohibition doesn't work...nuff said.

Pinkfairy
27-07-2004, 12:12 AM
Prohibition doesn't work...nuff said.
No, obviously, it doesn't. But it's the goverment's way to keep it under control...sort of. Really, it works in the way that it makes people aware that illegal drugs can hurt you, and the government is so concerned that they prohibit such drugs for people's benefit.

ryan
27-07-2004, 12:21 AM
Clearly, you've never seen stupid kids experimenting. Ha, in seventh grade a group of us were doing an experiment on how the nitcotine of cigarettes affected your lungs (for real). A couple of hours later, I was on the toilet throwing up for about ten minutes.
You made a good point.Still, Hazzle's idea is not bad, but it's not wise considering how many stupid people live.
Say drugs are legal. Sure, nobody gets addicted unless they allow it. Most people know the consequences of doing drugs (most drugs are designed with the purpose of getting people addicted). But Most people are stupid, and people will try them. Legalizing drugs would mean approving the bad habbit and providing people with justification for misconduct.

getting sick your first time and getting sick every time are not the same thing.

Pinkfairy
27-07-2004, 12:31 AM
getting sick your first time and getting sick every time are not the same thing.
I know that. I said you made a good point.
It actually depends on the person: second time I smoked, I got a headache, and my throat was sore. Of course, I realize that people who do smoke can do so bc they don't end up on the toilet afterwards. But the consequences of smoking are seen in the long run: ulcers, cancers, and many more.
I'm not saying everybody will suffer from these, but there are consequences. check estimates and statistics.

Dyce_Blue
27-07-2004, 12:34 AM
I just remembered something about drugs and whatnot...they are expensive. I think legalization of drugs would lead to more petty theft by people in need of money to keep their addiction alive.

Hazzle
27-07-2004, 12:38 AM
I just remembered something about drugs and whatnot...they are expensive. I think legalization of drugs would lead to more petty theft by people in need of money to keep their addiction alive.

Errr...bullshit. The prices of drugs are inflatedly high, as was the cost of alcohol during prohibition...legalisation would bring the price RIGHT down, actually negating the need for drug-related crime.

Yet another reason legalisation is the only solution. Having spent...3 years at University researching this, I'm pretty confident legalisation is the way to go...but what do I know?

ryan
27-07-2004, 12:43 AM
lower prices = more people affording = more people using = more people fucking up their lives because they don't know what they're doing.

Dyce_Blue
27-07-2004, 12:50 AM
What are the nutritional facts on a pack of Philip Morris Camel Cocaine? What about the serving size for Procter & Gamble Prestidigitary Pot Lite?

Hazzle
27-07-2004, 12:52 AM
lower prices = more people affording = more people using = more people fucking up their lives because they don't know what they're doing.

That works...because people like SO don't commit crimes to make sure they can afford it.

If you actually studied drug use, you'd find most people who use hard drugs CAN'T afford them, and come from poorer backgrounds than most who DO. They have to turn to crime...or things like prostitution.

Your logic is shit...I've heard that argument a million and one times before and it's pure logic not applied to the situation...logic in a vacuum is no help to this debate.

Pinkfairy
27-07-2004, 01:03 AM
What are the nutritional facts on a pack of Philip Morris Camel Cocaine? What about the serving size for Procter & Gamble Prestidigitary Pot Lite?
A hell of a good time (for the ten or so minutes that it takes to consume a cigarette)???
Seriously, I see your point.
The nicotine amount inhaled depends on each smoker.
According to Philip Morris the ingredients used in their cigarettes do not increase the inherent hazards of cigarette smoking.
Ok, we can all breath now, it's safe cause that makes cigarettes healthier...
It's never safe to smoke.

hasselbrad
27-07-2004, 12:56 PM
"I'd rather see a lecturer drink a can of coke, than use a couple of tabs of acid."

Really? I'd kind of like to see the latter. ;)

Hazzle
28-07-2004, 12:20 AM
"I'd rather see a lecturer drink a can of coke, than use a couple of tabs of acid."

Really? I'd kind of like to see the latter. ;)

Hehe...on that point...why can't jobs like that have regular drugs checks...I mean if they wanted to jobs could have regular breathaliser checks and this would be legal, despite the fact alcohol is legal. Drug checks do not require that the substance be illegal, you merely put it in the contract that people should not be intoxicated in any way and perform regular checks.

So far the ONLY good argument I've seen that I've not heard a million and one times before has been Poggs' that if drugs are seen as a rebellious thing, and they're then legalised, kids may be inclined to try more dangerous things to rebel.

DefyingGravity
29-07-2004, 01:42 PM
Marijuana is the only drug that I think there could possibly be a chance of becoming legal.

If marijuana becomes legal, people are going to abuse it the way they do alchohol. Even on the argument of putting restrictions on the legalization of marijuana, most people will NOT follow them(i.e., see alchohol), there will be even more people driving under the influence, and more people getting hurt because of it.

In my opinion, anything that impairs your judgement is bad. Feel free to try to change my opinion. It is free to be changed.

Hazzle
30-07-2004, 12:03 AM
Marijuana is the only drug that I think there could possibly be a chance of becoming legal.

If marijuana becomes legal, people are going to abuse it the way they do alchohol. Even on the argument of putting restrictions on the legalization of marijuana, most people will NOT follow them(i.e., see alchohol), there will be even more people driving under the influence, and more people getting hurt because of it.

In my opinion, anything that impairs your judgement is bad. Feel free to try to change my opinion. It is free to be changed.

Then let's ban alcohol and cigarettes while we're at it. I don't like the dual standard...ban it all or nothing...drink is FAR more dangerous than any illegal substance (did you know it kills more people every year than the illegal substances put together?) and yet it's legal...ban it all or nothing...we should stop being idiotic about it. I'd rather cocaine was legal than alcohol...

apoggy
30-07-2004, 12:29 AM
Not the Hazzle being sarcastic?

Making all drugs legal will only promote abuse, in the beginning at least, and probably make things far worse than they are now.

Now if you lok at it from a childs point of view no matter whether a substance is legal or not for the adults, it will always be illegal for them to take as age restrictions will still be put in place, so maybe this will still be seen as rebelious and thus not effect their usage. Ive just contradicted my earlier post :D

Hazzle
30-07-2004, 01:06 AM
Not the Hazzle being sarcastic?

Making all drugs legal will only promote abuse, in the beginning at least, and probably make things far worse than they are now.

Then why not ban legal drugs? I'm just sick of the double standard, and as one who had minor drink abuse issues, and grew up with an alcoholic father, has been to alcoholic counselling and seen people who've had it a HELL of a lot fucking harder than I have I just get sick at the dual standards. Ban it all, or ban none of it...the double standard just smacks of being too pussy to do the right thing.

Now if you lok at it from a childs point of view no matter whether a substance is legal or not for the adults, it will always be illegal for them to take as age restrictions will still be put in place, so maybe this will still be seen as rebelious and thus not effect their usage. Ive just contradicted my earlier post :D

<nods> I can see that...nice work :p

apoggy
30-07-2004, 01:17 AM
Then why not ban legal drugs? I'm just sick of the double standard, and as one who had minor drink abuse issues, and grew up with an alcoholic father, has been to alcoholic counselling and seen people who've had it a HELL of a lot fucking harder than I have I just get sick at the dual standards. Ban it all, or ban none of it...the double standard just smacks of being too pussy to do the right thing.


But a one size fits all approach is never the right way to do things. You need to look at each drug or at least each class of drug and estimate what will happen in both long and short term. Banning everything or making everything legal is not the way to go.

I do think however that if any drug was made legal the quantity/quality would be regulated and you would know exactly what you were taking. A lot of problems with drugs is caused by not knowing exactky what you are taking, a good or bad batch.

Hazzle
30-07-2004, 01:29 AM
But a one size fits all approach is never the right way to do things. You need to look at each drug or at least each class of drug and estimate what will happen in both long and short term. Banning everything or making everything legal is not the way to go.

I agree...but how does it make sense to NOT ban THE most dangerous drug...and criminalise others which aren't half as deadly?

I do think however that if any drug was made legal the quantity/quality would be regulated and you would know exactly what you were taking. A lot of problems with drugs is caused by not knowing exactky what you are taking, a good or bad batch.

That I agree with.

DefyingGravity
30-07-2004, 01:12 PM
Then let's ban alcohol and cigarettes while we're at it. I don't like the dual standard...ban it all or nothing...drink is FAR more dangerous than any illegal substance (did you know it kills more people every year than the illegal substances put together?) and yet it's legal...ban it all or nothing...we should stop being idiotic about it. I'd rather cocaine was legal than alcohol...

That's because illegal substances are illegal... hence the keyword illegal, so not as many people use them.

And it still hurts people. Alchohol is ENOUGH.

Hazzle
30-07-2004, 04:25 PM
That's because illegal substances are illegal... hence the keyword illegal, so not as many people use them.

So why not make alcohol illegal? then less people would use it, by your logic, so it'd kill less people. Oh wait...prohibition doesn't work...we saw that...it just created gangsters...just like illegal prostitution did for Vegas (hence the legalisation of it) and just like drugs do for Drug Barons. See a pattern? It's just so inconsistent

And it still hurts people. Alchohol is ENOUGH.

Yes, but I'd rather they banned alcohol and legalised marijuana...comparatively marijuana is like being licked on the face by a dog and alcohol is like being eaten alive...it's more dangerous, NOT because it's more used, but because it actually causes MORE damage to the body. Pretty much every organ in your body is damaged by alcohol. Your brain, liver, kidneys, heart...I could go on.

GRRRRR :mad:

I'm sorry, I feel fucking strongly about this...it's just fucking ridiculous that THE most dangerous drug around is legal...heck combine Cigarettes into the equation and alcohol and cigs kill a HELL of a lot more people than illegal substances.

You can say less people take it...but we're comparing TWO substances with a PLETHORA of substances and it's still a very one sided comparison. I'm sorry, I spent a LOT of time researching this, and then coupled with my own experience I'm convinced a ban on alcohol and cigs (it's idiotic to have a ban on smoking in public places whilst allowing people to indulge their addiction in private...it just encourages chain smoking which is worse for you) or legalisation of several illegal substances (if not all...as someone else said legalisation would ensure that less people died because of having impure drugs, having the wrong dosage etc...in short it'd kill less people, even if more people did it...and there are hundreds of reports that back that conclusion up) is the way forward.

I think people are just far too fucking empathetic and dragging emotions into what SHOULD be a logical argument...and it's simply illogical to have alcohol and cigarettes legal, and marijuana illegal.

Dyce_Blue
30-07-2004, 06:33 PM
Marijuana may be illegal, but it is more obtainable than many other substances. There are various people in my neighborhood who smoke it on their side porches in the middle of the day. There are certain NFL stars (Ricky Williams) openly announcing early retirement to go smoke weed. The law exists, but it is only the careless that are caught. This pisses me off because it really leaves no incentive to do the right thing.

Marijuana is "safer" than smoking cigarettes. I am already screwed then, because I have inhaled intense second-hand tobacco smoke everyday since I was born. I guess this means my lungs are messed up severely just for breathing the air in my own house.


it's simply illogical to have alcohol and cigarettes legal, and marijuana illegal.

I know about alcohol, too. There are laws in place, but who follows them? The first "real" party I ever went to (I was 14) had 3 kegs. It's not fun to be in a room half-full of 9th graders who are smashed beyond belief, and half-full of 9th graders pretending to be wasted just to be cool.

Even if the law prohibits it, especially here in Texas, there is no stopping more than half the student body at my former high school of 4,000 from getting drunk every single weekend. There is nothing stopping their parents from smoking weed at home when they are away. There is nothing stopping drunks driving home from a bar. There is also nothing in the world that would get me to abuse alcohol or come anywhere near burning leaves rolled in paper.

Creating a law to prohibit something merely affects those who are caught. I know someone that makes a one-mile commute home from a bar everyday, he is drunk and sometimes high. He speeds, swerves, and misses his driveway when he tries to park at home. Chances are that in about ten years of doing this, this individual would have gotten pulled over at least once. This person has a perfect driving record and is a respected and law-abiding member of the community until 3 PM. After that, I guess legislation no longer applies.


I'm sorry, I feel fucking strongly about this

I too feel very strongly about this issue. I am greatly affected by controlled substances even though I have yet to use one.

Hazzle
30-07-2004, 09:04 PM
Glad someone else sees my point :)

Kelsey
30-07-2004, 09:18 PM
Weed should just be legal, everyone does it anyways. Maybe if it were legal and there was no "rebel" image attached to it, less people would do it. I laugh at the people who smoke weed because if they're not idiots already, they will be soon.