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View Full Version : Do you Believe in the Supernatural?


Nick
10-03-2007, 01:10 PM
http://www.zurichmansion.org/ghosts/index.htm

Take a look at this site and the "evidence" on it. Does it convince you that the dead are walking among us? Well it doesn't convince me. I've always been a skeptic and this site didn't make me any less of one. It's just peoples imaginations running away with them, that's all, nothing more. They have pictures on here that have what they insist are apparitions, I think it's just camera defects. Either that or somebody doctored the photos, it's not hard to do that now days.
Anyway, I'm interested to hear some other peoples opinions. So take a look at the site and listen to some of the audio tracks and look at the photos that are presented.

Norseman
11-03-2007, 01:18 AM
No, I don't. Why? Why should I. Never experienced anything remotely supernatural. Neighter has any of my friends. No "media's" walking around in some TV show going: "oohh I feel an angry force here" are going to convince me eighter.

Not for me.

Jacoby
11-03-2007, 04:52 PM
No, I don't. Why? Why should I. Never experienced anything remotely supernatural. Neighter has any of my friends. No "media's" walking around in some TV show going: "oohh I feel an angry force here" are going to convince me eighter.

Not for me.

Eighter ~ Noun ~ One who eights. A person who one mores than seven.


Ghosts are cool. I don't know if I think it's real. I think it's all just a sense of paranoia humans face when they're in the dark. Instincts kick in and we feel threatened, often by nothing.

Leonie
11-03-2007, 07:08 PM
I'm not sure. On the one hand, I like rationalising things: I'm more likely to trust a scientific explanation than a supernatural one.

However, Jacoby's comment made me think: instincts kick in in the dark, and we feel threatened. Instincts come from thousands of years of evolution. Being afraid of the dark outdoors is understandable: some wild animal or a thug of sorts could sneak up on you and have his evil ways with you. Historically, anyway. However, fear of the dark inside one's own home seems illogical from an evolutionary perspective. Nevertheless we do have an instinct to be spooked (pun not intended) by perceived or real movement and sound indoors. You'd think the instinct would have an evolutionary reason. Then again, perhaps us silly humans aren't too good at risk calculations, perhaps somehow our little brains don't understand that we're home and safe.

I don't know.

michael22
12-03-2007, 03:29 AM
I am on the same page as Leonie on this one. The subject is a dull grey area for me.

Nick
12-03-2007, 06:16 AM
I think there's a perfectly logical and scientific explanation for "supernatural" events. The argument that believers use is why haven't scientists been able to come up with an explanation for "hauntings"? The answer to that is that it takes a long time to come up with a scientific theory and actually prove it. I mean just think of how long it took for some one to finally prove that the earth was round and not flat. Being that the research of "paranormal activiy" is a fairly new field in the scientific community, it will take a while before they can come up with a theory and then once they have a theory they have to find evidence to prove it. Just because they haven't come up with an explanation yet doesn't mean there isn't one or that they never will find one, it's just a matter of time.

Liam
12-03-2007, 08:31 AM
I reckon they should try and cure cancer instead of spend time and money on bullshit like ghosts.

mongoose
12-03-2007, 02:50 PM
I reckon they should try and cure cancer instead of spend time and money on bullshit like ghosts.

Yes, but cancer doesn't fit in the horror storys, while ghosts on the other hand...
( Cancer is more tragic and dramatic )

Leonie
12-03-2007, 06:06 PM
Cancer no horror? Don't repeat that in front of families that had to deal with it.
But i get what you mean.

He didn't say that. And remember that like yourself, English? Not the native language. He said cancer doesn't fit in horror stories. That's rather different :)

On topic, I still don't know, but I have a question. Does believing in God or Allah or whatever mean that you believe in the supernatural?

hasselbrad
12-03-2007, 06:09 PM
I thought it was 10%.
As for the supernatural, I think a lot of things are actually hallucinations brought on by intense fear and anxiety. We tend to see what we are looking for. If you are in a house that is supposed to be haunted, you probably will feel a chill when you walk into the room where the ghastly act that condemned the deceased to an eternity of haunting supposedly occurred.
It's kind of like LSD. If you are predisposed to see claws on the end of your fingers, then that's what you'll see when you look at your hand. If, on the other hand, you are predisposed to see butterflies emerge from your palm, that's what your mind will be tricked into seeing.
Maybe the other 90% (or 80%) is filled with the crazy imagination that powers such things.

Leonie
12-03-2007, 06:15 PM
I mean supernatural in the sense that in a way, it's also believing in a presence beyond our tangible world. It's believing in something that has not been scientifically proven.

That said, it would be a stretch to believe in both God and poltergeists, perhaps. Not that people haven't, in the past, but I think that most large, organised religions sort of dismiss the whole spirits thing. Unless, of course, they're Holy. Heh.

Digital_Ice
12-03-2007, 06:45 PM
...this is getting very theological.

im inclined to agree with leonie on this one.

...Open-mindedness is a great thing.

Leonie
12-03-2007, 06:56 PM
Shamanism.

Yes, and also, you know, the Holy Spirit? He's kinda in the Bible :icon_razz

Leonie
12-03-2007, 07:03 PM
How else would we know about the crown of flames (if I remember correctly)? :icon_razz

And I still don't know where I stand on this issue, I just know that if I don't get three assignments done in the next 14 hours, I'm screwed. So as you were, and I'll be back.

hasselbrad
12-03-2007, 07:12 PM
Yeah, but God doesn't do anything about assignments or her professors.
:p

Leonie
12-03-2007, 07:17 PM
Do I strike you as particularly religious?

Let's just say that I'll be a staunch believer in hell's existence if I don't get these assignments done.

Porcelain_Doll
12-03-2007, 09:49 PM
Aren't God and Allah an invention of man to help humanity make the choice between good and bad? (Not succeeding btw :p).

No kidding. Someone should page these guys.

"Are you there, God? It's us, the freakin' world!!!!Answer!!!!"

Or, if you're not sure if the old man upstairs really exists (like yours truly), just forget this and continue talking about Casper. :p

michael22
12-03-2007, 11:43 PM
even the joining of the KKW?

Nick
14-03-2007, 10:47 AM
I think God, Allah, and whatever other Deity you might believe in counts as supernatural. The definition of the word supernatural is, 1. of, pertaining to, or being above or beyond what is natural; unexplainable by natural law or phenomena; abnormal.
2. of, pertaining to, characteristic of, or attributed to God or a deity.

There you have it, gods/deity's fall under supernatural because they cannot be proven nor disproven by science and are beyond the realms of "natural law."

Personally I'm agnostic so I don't think anyone can know if there is or isn't a "God" or higher being of some kind up there somewhere. Even if there is a "higher power," who's to say it's the God described in the Christian Bible. Maybe the Muslims are right or the Jews, or Buddhists. Or maybe all religions are partially right, I mean if you think about it most of the gods of monotheistic religions share similar traits.
Anyway that's just something else for you all to chew on.

AureaMediocritas
15-03-2007, 03:52 AM
To go straight to the point, in my opinion any god, from
shamanism to old pagan gods to our modern single God is
initially an invention of clever people to #### less clever
people in their #####. Playing on the natural need for
explanations, (which seems to have caused the belief in
primitive society that there must be some insanely powerful
freaks causing thunder, rain, sun etc. called gods, later on
evolving into one big God), such manipulative guys
(comparable today to politicians) knew the profits. By
becoming important socially (priests, prophets, ascetics...) as
mediators with the supernatural boss(es), it becomes
traditionally easy to create further superstitions
(example: the Roman augurs (!) ), thereby comfortably
securing privileges.

As a result, you get monsters like the Catholic Church
responsible for millions of deaths on the planet historically (and
today with AIDS in Africa). Then again you have the issue
with so called "heresies", rivals that for example dont accept papal privileges and so on and so forth.

To me it is a long story of inventing bullshite either based on ignorance, worries as to the future or natural catastrophes.

Which does not mean every religion is bad, as long as you dont slaughter "heathens, infidels, heretics" etc., a reason why I
favour the good old Roman custom of letting live conquered
populations with their old customs, however weird they are.


So, for me the supernatural is a product of imagination.
:icon-mrgr

hasselbrad
15-03-2007, 01:10 PM
good old Roman custom of letting live conquered
populations with their old customs, however weird they are.

Which fits in with what you said about other religions.
The Romans didn't care if you worshipped a stick wrapped in thread so long as you paid your taxes and kept your trap shut.

AureaMediocritas
15-03-2007, 05:10 PM
Although it is slightly off topic, Romans were clever enough to realize that to hold their imperium together, it would be madness to institute their own gods everywhere. With the divine emperors things started to complicate for exclusivistic religions such as Christianity or the Judaism as they refused to honour Rome by participating in its official cult to the city and the emperor.
So all this bizarre condemning of persecutions... one just has to move on another 300 years to see what the Christian Roman empire was : hell for dissidents and non believers...